As we approach the holiday season, many a family dinner table is occupied by religious conversation. For a little back-story, Penn Jillette speaks on the subject: [video=youtube;uh_gGQ9s5_Q]http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=fvwpb&v=uh_gGQ9s5_Q&NR=1[/video] What are your thoughts? I've heard that school boards get in trouble for using the phrase "Christmas break" because it isn't inclusive. I think this is silly, because I highly doubt anyone would complain if it was called "Kwanza Break" or "Hanukkah Break". As an Atheist, I don't really care what the break is called, as long as you don't force anyone to celebrate a religious holiday during said break. This also means that I don't really care if the name is changed, however. Alright then, I'll call it Winter Break. But why does it matter? I'd like to know what everybody thinks about this.
I don't really care what people call it. What gets on my nerves is people getting pissed off at the term "happy holidays." I mean really. Then there are those who go on about a "war on Christmas," which I just find silly. They have an entire Christmas break, a national holiday (the only religious holiday that is also a national one), and a large majority of people celebrate it. Sometimes I think these people confuse not getting their way 100% of the time with a war.
Well I call it Summer holidays here, or Christmas holidays. Thankfully, no one over here really cares what it's called, most are so relieved to have a break that even if they do not celebrate Christmas they'll still say, "Oh thank you, you too!"
Whoever legitimately complains about the name of a holiday (season) has issues... seriously... I mean, who in their right mind would possibly try to fight something no one really cares about. Maybe some people do, but even then i doubt they care that much. I mean, you could call Christmas "Zambambo Day" and i still wouldn't care
In response to each of the terms getting sillier and sillier, I say you could call it "fling monkey feces at a wall day" and us students wouldn't care as long as we don't have to put up with the staff that seems to be 80% heartless, 10% cool and kind, 9% heartless, and 1% satanic for two weeks! Seriously though, we have a teacher at our school who is a satanist. Yami has point. I hate it when people just HAVE TO HAVE THEIR way. All or nothing is easy. Anyone can do that. What takes control however, is moderation. Oh wait, that's the speech about alcohol. Sorry, let me reboot.
Antitheist here. I could argue against the validity of even the phrase "happy holidays" because 'holiday' is "holy day" and I don't believe in holy things. But to me the holiday's name or how people express it isn't as important as what people mean when they say they wish you a happy one. It means just that--they wish you a happy day. Or week or whatever. If I took personal offense to that I'd probably have a lot less friends. I think the name "Christmas break" does imply that the break is intended for a religious purpose, but most of us (especially myself) don't care. We're more concerned with getting out of work or school for a week, hanging out with friends, getting presents, or doing whatever it is we do. The name is legacy really; it started from religion, and even though the holiday is becoming secular, changing it is too much work (hell, even though I turned away from religion I still say "merry Christmas" just because I was raised Christian so I'm so used to saying it). What's important is what people mean when they say the words, not what the dictionary says. Especially in my opinion, in which all the holidays are equally meaningless. So "merry Christmas", "happy holidays", who cares? You're still wishing someone a happy something and that matters. And if you would rather not say anything than use a different term wish someone a happy something else, then well. You have problems. Consider it done.
Considering this year, I'll just wish everyone a Merry No-Apocalypse Day. Everyone can be happy about that.
I don't really get the deal with why it matters what it's called. Believe in any story you like behind this holiday, if it alters the name, no matter, but either way it's a time to celebrate, and we shouldn't let religious arguments get in the way of that celebration (or the presents).
Christmas came about as a result of the birth of Christ. We celebrate the holiday to represent the giving of gifts from the Wise Men to Jesus in the stable. Marketing has been used to commercialise this into what we now refer to as "Santa Clause". So if Atheists are saying it shouldn't be called Christmas because that's not fair to those not in the Christian faith, that's just plain greed. It's "Christ"mas for a reason, Atheists celebrate it regardless of what the holiday entails each year, so the least they can do is show the holiday some respect. It's not their holiday, no-one forced them to be a part of it, it belongs and was created by the Christian faith, for Christians. But because of the vast thing known as commercialism, it's grown into a tradition in almost every home. So to not call it Christmas is pretty damn offensive and disrespectful to the Christian faith, it's their holiday and Atheists are lucky it's even vastly celebrated outside of the faith. I'm not saying people should be forced to celebrate it, I'm actually saying quite the opposite. If you're an Atheist and you're not celebrating Christmas, fine, enjoy your break. But if you're an Atheist who is celebrating Christmas, the least you can do is show the faith who created it some respect. If you don't, you're taking from something you claim is wrong and not truthful in my books, and that's a little hypocritical. They don't complain about the name of Easter, despite that being a Christian holiday, so Christians should be able to do what they damn well please with the name of their traditions. What I can't stand is when people call it "Xmas".
Like most people, I couldn't care less about what it's called. I'm happy to get a break and so should everyone else. EDIT: Also what Poetic said. This is now canon.
I think you missed the point Poetic. Not that anything you said is wrong. You're just a little off the mark. We're not trying to change the name of the holiday, we're talking about whether it's okay to say things other than "Christmas" in greetings or when describing your vacation. Christmas is a Christian thing, but other faiths get things too. So it certainly isn't about atheists taking offense to the word "Christmas" (as the previous posts have shown, atheists are probably the last group to take offense to what the holiday is called, lol). Atheists only speak up about "happy holidays" because they want all faiths to have their celebrations equally--after all, they don't favor any particular one. Yes, changing the name of Christmas would dishonor all of Christianity. But that's not what the phrase "happy holidays" is trying to do. The thing about Christmas is, while it's obviously meant only for Christians, it happens at the same time as other religions' holidays. You generally can't tell which one someone celebrates just by looking at them (and if you can, I don't know if you're ridiculously perceptive or a prejudiced ass). So saying "merry Christmas" can be disrespectful to those people just because it assumes they celebrate Christmas and not something else. So not wanting to say "Christmas" isn't an atheist thing, it's a non-Christian thing. "Happy holidays" doesn't carry that religious overtone, so people push for it to just be festive without favoring or disfavoring anyone's faith. We could just as easily say "winter break" or "end-of-year break" or "Zambambo break" to leave religion out of it as well. Maybe Easter has no similar issues because it doesn't conflict with any other culture's holidays chronologically. Or maybe it's just more okay to say "happy Easter" than "merry Christmas" because the word is less overtly Christian (the name "Easter" comes from Ēostre--a Germanic pagan goddess--so if you ask me it's more strange that Christians are okay with the name). Or maybe it's that marketing is turning public Easter displays into generic, politically correct spring celebrations instead of a remembrance of the Resurrection like it was supposed to be. In all honesty I don't know the answer. I don't know why people are less bothered Easter greetings than Christmas ones.
well, here, there's actually no problems about Christmas holidays. For most of people, Christmas has grown more as traditional family holiday, more than religious holiday (like, let's say Valentine's day, just it's not working day/whole week(s)). As for word "holiday", in Croatian, word for holiday is "praznici", which literately translates to "non working day". So there's no "holy" in word "holiday" (in Croatian) So people just say Božićni praznici (Christmas holidays) (because they are around Christmas), or more often "Zimski raznici" (Winter holidays (which often implies traditional skiing week which is usually one week after New Year)). So, essentially, every non working day (religious or notional) (that's not Saturday or Sunday) is holiday, since translation for word "holiday" is "non working day". Also, in Croatia, if you're part of some other religion, you have right not to work (or college or school) on your religious holidays, so you can celebrate them, and they always congratulate them on the news, radio, tv, etc.
I am not a Christian, but every faith deserves respect, and crossing Christ out of Christmas is incredibly offensive even to me. If not for Christ, then celebrate it for all the family unity it brings. Just respect it as you would with any other faith's special day. It should never be just about the presents...Ever seen how Jack Skellington was not able to understand the meaning of Christmas? I'm convinced it is because he missed a vital part, Christ. It is fine even for Atheists to say Happy Christmas, since it IS a Christmas. They are free to not celebrate, same with Hannukah, Kwanzaa, but if you live with Christians, wish them their holiday by its name, because that is what it is for them. Arguing about a name of something that brings a lot of good is simply complicating a beautiful day and beautiful world.
Well... to be precise.... Christmas has its origin in pagan rites. So it can not be said it is a just clear christian holliday.
I wouldn't say that. Most of the way it's celebrated nowadays--with the tree and whatnot--is pagan, but the name and purpose for it are definitely Christian in origin. Not all Christians bother with trees for that reason.
Agreed. I think you misunderstood, Poetic. We're not talking about changing the name of the holiday, as that would be silly. But rather how to refer to the entire month of December, essentially. I don't see the problem with something like "happy holidays" really, because it includes Christmas along with the other holidays as well, including Hanukkah, New Year's, Kwanzaa. It's inclusive for all, and so gives non-Christians a nod as well. Perhaps you took the topic title the wrong way? I do think it's a bit misleading.
Oh actually it was celebrated on that day before Christ was born, the Winter solstice was celebrated on the 25. of december if i remember that right. And the christians adapted it to their religion in the 3rd century after christ was born. There is prove for the winter solstice celebration that is much older. Well yes the name is Christian thats right
