The Gay Thread

I do worry for the voice of the people to be heard, yet technically must disagree.

To overturn the people's vote is not unconstitutional, considering the purpose of the Supreme Court is to decide what is and isn't constitutional.

 

And this is the point. In no way shape or form has denying someone gay marriage in the past ever been declared discrimination or unconstitutional; so you have these guys saying that the Supreme Court shouldn't do anything with it. And frankly, I agree.

I think that stuff needs to happen internally before they can go all willy nilly and overturning votes.

 

First of all, the entire case of Proposition 8 is that the California courts DID declare this discrimination unconstitutional. That is the whole point of this legal battle. And that's not just limited to California, several states' courts and a handful of federal circuit courts have also officially declared that singling out same-sex couples as unworthy of marriage for no justifiable reason is both discriminatory at face value and legally violates the equal protection clauses of various state and federal constitutions.

And secondly, nothing the Supreme Court does is "willy nilly" - this one case has taken them years to even hear, and then once they heard it they have gone on to deliberate it for months.

 

I think that ignores our fundamental system of checks and balances. In my opinion, all laws should be viewed at length by the Supreme Court. Also, I believe you have it backwards; the overturning of a law/ruling/vote is the precedent that allows the Supreme Court to label something as unconstitutional. Something has to be overturned first, then the concept becomes unconstitutional.

 

Gay people are amazing.
Bisexuals follow the same path.
I would very much like to get involved in this thread, despite being a heterosexual.

 

Don't mind you, just yet another heterosexual supporting the LGBT.
But seriously though, you can discuss a bit about this subject here, I don't really think you have to be gay to participate in a discussion about gays.

 

My mum always told me she wouldn't mind about my sexuality. She brought me up with the idea that I should love the person, not their privates.
If you catch my drift.
I went through a bi-phase, I'm still sort of in it, but I don't really.. err.. use it?

 

How exactly would you use it? You can really only use one at a time in public ~.^ (I am slightly ashamed of that joke)

 

What I'm trying to say is I've never really been sexually open with males yet. I'm more curious than anything.

 

well hey, feel free to explore your feelings here. this is a pretty safe place, and if you had any questions about anything im sure a more experienced person on any subjects you could think of would be glad to answer.

Always glad to see people who are not explicitly LGBT also part of the conversation in a positive way ^_^

 

While looking for pony forums one of my biggest criteria was did most of the users accept the LGBT community. I'm happy to say I think I found the forums I'm looking for. While straight myself, I 100% support LGBT rights. And while I say I am straight I don't define gender by priviate parts, so I've had transgendered girlfriends before. I'm so happy to see all the LGBT support here.

 

First of all; I'm glad you like it here ^_^ we're happy to have you.
and secondly, that's awesome that you are secure enough with sexuality that having a trans partner is something your comfortable with. I know this is "the gay thread" but I think trans issues are a pretty big deal that a lot of times get left out of "LGBT" discussions. I've also had a trans partner, and it can be very difficult - not because they aren't awesome and I love them, but because trans rights are so far behind gay rights (for cisgendered people), and every day is just another opportunity for complete strangers, family members, the government, or the media at large to harass and attack them for no reason.

 

I've been under the impression that this was basically an all-round queer thread (or LGBT, or LGBTQ+, or QUILTBAG, whatever floats your boat).

Props to straight or gay people who have no problem with dating trans people. I cannot even begin to imagine how hard that must be to bring up in a new relationship.

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So, here's a thing: Gay bars who shun (or even turn away) people of the 'wrong' gender or orientation. This is a thing that annoys me. I don't see who segregation is helping.

 

I'm not a fan of it either, but it's a lot more complicated than people give the situation credit for.

First, when we are getting into non normative gender expression and people more in the Q category, exclusion does seem very discriminatory and it's pretty much just cis-gender gay people pushing down other minorities and doing exactly what straight people do to them, which I 100% am against and think is awful.

But when "gay bars" are uncomfortable about letting straight people in, I see a lot more legitimacy to that. Yea it's not fair if you personally aren't homophobic, but it's not like straight people can't find somewhere else to go - there are plenty of straight-only bars (either by being discriminatory or by actually literally barring gay people as an official policy). So I view this as just defensiveness by the gay community about people they have no reason to trust, and are just trying to make sure no one that would cause a problem in their bar gets in. Like I said, it's not ideal and for maybe bisexual people or well meaning straight people it isn't fair and I think there should be a better system for weeding out people that would go there just to make trouble. (but yea, im just pointing out the logic behind it)

 

Im bi and people make fun of me...

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Its really sad how people call gay/lesbian/bi people "*squee!*s" and "homos" and "dikes", and then use it negatively. In my opinion its stupid to make fun of people because they like the same gender..

 

Yeah, I understand the logic behind it. I have discussed it before with people who are all for it. An additional argument I have heard is that people are afraid of hitting on straight people. The thing is:
1. Homophobic harrassment in bars aren't really an issue here. Sure, maybe is you go to a really soddy one where people are generally a pain in the butt. If you give people a hard time you will be thrown out or even arrested.
2. Sometimes people go out as a group of diverse friends, not to score, but to simply have fun. And that's okay.
Any way, it's only one or two bars in town that do it, and it's actually illegal. Oh well.

 

Ah, I see; I just realized your profile says Denmark. I guess I can only speak as an american then - bar fights between gay and straight people are fairly common over here.

 

What part of America are we talking?


I've been in /loads/ of bars and nightclubs all over the NorthEast. NJ, PA, OH, NY... I have yet to walk into one were somebody being gay was an issue, or even a concern.





*Oh, and a bit of news: Read in the NY Times yesterday that a company called Exodus International decided to close. They were a corporation that sought to "reform" gay people with prayer and psychotherapy and were a big leader of the "ex-gay" movement. Their president made an announcement to the effect of 'yeah, we're really probably doing more harm than good' so they disbanded the company/organization whatever they are. Of course this hasn't stopped anything, but it's a very positive change and very likely an indicator of how homosexual acceptance is becoming more and more commonplace in the States. So that's good.

 

Well, in general, the northeast and parts of the west coast are definitely more accepting than some other places, but it still happens. I'm actually from Massachusetts, so you'd think no one has a problem there right? well unfortunately not; it just gives most people an excuse to cover up this kind of thing or brush it off. It's obviously not happening in every bar in america, every single day, but it does happen, every once in a while; and it's why gay bars even exist in the first place. If people were all content and mature enough not to harass or fight with each other then the gay community would have had no reason to operate their own bars in the first place.

I've never personally gotten into trouble at a bar, cause i'm kinda big and normative-looking so I don't stick out very much, but I've known friends that got harassed at the very least, or once had a really scary encounter with some guys following them when they left a bar... So maybe it's not even about "fights" specifically... just harassment and feeling generally unsafe that leads to this divide.