Guns for kids: Acceptable or outrageous?

I live in 'merica and I don't see why this country is so obsessed with guns. Does it matter if this country was founding with rebels with guns. We also had slaves and drove natives off the land. Should we count those too?

Why do they even need guns? I guess there fun to shot but I didn't get anything out of it. Maybe it's for protection, everyone seems to carry a gun now, so why not.

I don't care for the second amendment anyway, let them do what they want. It's not like they can be stopped anyway if they really wanted to get rid of it.


So I gotta disagree with the 2 americans above me.

Guns are stupid

 

Mate, I seriously don't like your attitude. Right about now, you sound like some stuck-up bigoted nationalist. To put it in your words, you're 'incapable' of seeing other points of view.

 

I'm sorry, but I don't think tradition is worth the lives of innocent men, women and children. All it takes is one nutter with a bit of money to go down, buy a rifle and shoot up the place. This is a simple cold, hard fact. I believe that some people should have the legal right to carry guns. But this should require a license and should only apply to those above a certain age limit. If your fine with handing your child something which is one wrong move away from wounding or killing them or anyone in the general area, that blood will be on your hands as far as I'm concerned.

 

Gonna stop you right there. America was founded through war, and yes we love our weapons but remember everyone, overseas is where we fight. Meaning there are alot more terrorist attacks there than here. WAY more. They understand the importance of PoW (Personally owned Weapons) for their own self defense. But America is still a young nation. They have been around way longer and lets face it terrorists had to come from somewhere. Whether the operating terrorist units operating in they're area are indigenous or not. Not being armed means they're not a threat. and any smart man with a gun and an army knows not to waste ammunition on non-combatants.

That being being said I do value the tradition of teaching our offspring to use weapons. But starting them before they're even in middle school is a bit extreme. 11 is the perfect age to start with a BB gun (If your OCD 10) But we do still need to remember what we teach them COULD be used against us at some point. Everyone becomes someone and we have no idea what their intentions are until the aftermath.

- - Auto Merge - -

Guns aren't the only weapon used for harm. I could say guns don't kill people, people kill people but that'd just be too cliche. Because lets face it and not meaning anything by it, I could kill you with a pencil, wire, metal bar, baseball bat, glass bottle, your prescription eyeglasses, ​my bare hands etc...

 

I think this whole thing is getting taken out of what is true and what isn't based on nationality.

Most Europeans seem to think that getting rid of guns would make America a much better place; However, take a look at Switzerland.

Every single one of the home owners there (Or close to it) own a gun. Look at the crime rates. Extremely low.

Why?

Because they know that if they break into that house, or they wanna kill someone, there is a gun waiting right there. Criminals aren't going to want to risk their lives over 100 bucks worth of furniture or something.

Now take a look at US cities with high amounts of legal firearms.

These cities have lower crime rates than those with no firearms, or severely limited gun laws, presumably for the same reason as above.

Now take a look at where all the crime comes from.

Illegally obtained guns.

That is the problem. Most murders or gun violence comes from unregistered/stolen guns/illegally purchased guns, not guns that are properly liscenced or tracked.

Taking away these legal guns is like saying 'Hey, you there, the guy who just bought that rifle illegally. Come into my house and rob me dry, because I have no way to have a gun!'


Taking away guns leaves the good guys without guns, and puts the good guys in danger of the bad guys with the bigger guns.

Removing guns is paving the way to very high crime rates.

If by countless, you mean 4 college shootings that happened in the last decade. And all of those weapons, sans the elementary school shooting, were illegally obtained.

Nothing to do with gun safety, it has to do with the people supplying the guns.

 

And I agree. The responsibility and self respect in this country has dwindled to an alarming rate.

 

I was not NOT trying to come across as "stuck up."
I was only trying to point out that asking people to throw away a basic American right is a little bit unreasonable.

Also, I'm not fond of your attitude, either. Intentional or not, many of your posts come off as aggressive and arrogant. (Yes, I do see the hypocrisy. I just feel that we should try to keep the Serious Discussion forum civil.)

 

While I don't approve of your over-simplification with the United States-Switzerland comparison (let's be honest: there are more factors involved there than just guns), I do think you make a very good point when it comes to crime rates. Obviously, guns affect crime rates, and a very specific solution for the regulation of firearms - one that does not infringe upon the freedoms granted to the American people by their Constitution - should be sought.

False. There have been more shooting on or near college campuses involving students in my state in the past couple years alone than that. You're just citing the big, famous ones where lots of people died.

 

You're right, I was referring to the ones where more than 2-3 people were killed on a campus.

 

(OOC)
This is a hunter/ Gun Enthusiast POV.
Personally, I see quite a few problems in it, even though I got my first gun when I was in 8th grade.
The difference?
It isn't legally mine, it was my parent's, but we keep it in my room and it is the one I use to go hunting. They keep the ammo in their room and had me unload it each time after I used it.
And they taught me BASIC GUN SAFETY such as
Never assume a guns unloaded
Make sure anyone in the basic area is FAR behind you when you use the gun
Never point a gun at someone else even WITH the safety on (Even if you're just joking, the safety could fail and next thing you know you're charged with murder.)


and a ton of more things, but these were the basic things. Another thing is is that I only own a 22. rifle, a few high power air guns, and a Remington 870 20 gauge shotgun, up until highschool when I'm getting a Marlin 336.

So with all of my personal experience of owning a gun at a young age, here is my verdict.

Handing a gun that isn't a murder machine to a MIDDLE SCHOOLER (Heck I would wait till highschool if I were a parent thinking about getting my child a gun), is like handing an M game to a 10 year old, or showing the movie Predator to your 8 year old.

You have to
1. Moderate the living heck out of them, make sure they don't keep the AMMO and THE GUN.

2. Make sure they are MATURE enough to handle it. Despite guns being a right where I live in America, they are also a privilege to us. Every time we use them immaturely, the government threatens to take them away from all of us, and takes them away from the individual who did it. In other words, if you're child is saying "YOLO" and talking about how awesome weed is. Get them a Red Ryder, not a Winchester.

3. Make them EARN the gun. Again this all has to do with maturity. You think I got my first 22. rifle because I wrote to Santa that I wanted to shoot some squirrels? No, in order to get a gun and start hunting, I had to first show my parents I was mature enough to handle the power of KILLING something. The second your 11 year old starts cursing and saying "When I get my gun I'm gonna bust a cap in you!", tell them that they have 10 more years before they get one.

4. Get them a low caliber gun. The first thing I ever hunted was squirrels, not bears. A middle schooler has no reason to own a .375 REVOLVER.

5. Don't get them a Semi-automatic or a pistol. Pistol's are DESIGNED for self defense, they are literally made to kill a person. Semi-automatics are the kinds of guns they use in the military, and really are only useful for pack animals when it comes to hunting. And for Christ sake, unless you want to see your little angel doing drive-bys, don't get them a Glock 17 or Browning M1911, or any semi-automatic pistol.

I could go on and on, but anyone with common sense who carefully thought about getting their child a gun, should be able to find what I said and MORE regulations to gun safety when a child uses a gun.

 

it is not if it was legal but the fact that parents didn't make sure to supervise their kid with the thing that would cause this.

3 basic rules with guns for any one who has guns and kids.
1. common sense says that you keep your guns locked in a safe when your not home so kids and others don't misuse them while the responsible party is away.
2.if you let your kids have a gun, then untill the reach a level of maturity where they can demonstrate enough responsibility to always follow gun safety like not pointing at others then you must be literally hands on with helping them line up a shot and learning to shoot safely instead of freely handing them a weapon and saying here try hitting the bottle over there.
3 you never ever allow them to touch or use the weapon without your supervision (this is where rules 1 and 2 come into play)
4 you turn them over your knee and spank them till they can't walk if they even play point the gun at others, even if there is no ammo in it and it has a trigger lock on it at the time, you must enforce good gun safety or they will end up hurting someone.
5 adding to rule one, even if no safe is available you buy and use a gun lock, my rifle came with a lock for the bolt, but trigger locks are good too.
6 also always make sure that your guns, every one you own or have in the house, is accounted for and safely stored/locked and the like before you ever walk away.

its not a problem if a responsible parent actually teaches their kids right from wrong and then still makes sure to always ensure the gun is properly locked and stored in a place your kids have no keys to open.
kids don't have common sense but there is no excuse for a parent not being responsibble.

in short guns for kids are completely acceptable, being a dumba** parent is never acceptable and i retain the right to backhand/slap your kid in the mouth for you if you as an adult refuse to summon the courage and parenting ability to properly teach your kids right from wrong.

here this equestrian prince as he makes this decree, no parent shall be allowed to neglect their kids without being held responsible by the royal guard and the legal system should their neglect result in injuries to their child and i again maintain the right to swiftly plant my clidesdale hoof thouroghly up your backside should i catch you not teaching your kids better than to point guns at anything they don't need to.
accidents like your article don't happen when the occasional size 13 wide horseshoe print is left as a dent in someones plot to remind them to step up and be good parents to their little colts and filles.
even my own kids should i ever have them will have guns if they want, but i will not give them keys to the locks and stuff till they are atleast 18 yrs old and can prove to me they are responsible enough to not abuse their guns

 

As others have pointed out, this incident happened due to lax supervision of a a child with a firearm. Basic gun safety dictates that one must always treat a firearm as if it were loaded.

I started out shooting a BB gun when I was eight years old, and I was always under my grandfather's supervision when I was shooting it. In fact, that gun only came out of its case when the targets were already in place on the land where we happened to be shooting. Otherwise, it remained locked away.

Incidents like this are entirely the fault of the child's parents, and these occurrences are cynically used by anti-gun politicians to push their agendas.

 

You say you started with a BB gun at eight. That's all well and good, but there's a big difference between BBs and .22-caliber bullets. Are you saying it's okay for a 5-year-old to start out with a .22 caliber rifle, even with supervision?

 

(OOC)

This was done with a youth rifle? They do realize that by Youth rifle, they mean teenagers, right?

 

Wrong.
Youth rifles are designed to be a "first gun."
In rural areas, guns are a part of everyday life, and it is not uncommon for a child to learn to shoot before their tenth birthday.
Of course, such activities are always SUPERVISED.

 

why does a kid of 5 years old have a gun?
I mean it`ll be something normal but strange that a parent take his 13 or 14 years old son to a field to shoot 2 or 3 shoots with dad`s gun but why a 5 years old?!

 

I think I'll just quote something here.

'In District of Columbia v. Heller, 554 U.S. 570 (2008), the Supreme Court ruled that the Second Amendment "codified a pre-existing right" and that it "protects an individual right to possess a firearm unconnected with service in a militia, and to use that arm for traditionally lawful purposes, such as self-defense within the home"[9][10] but also stated that "the right is not unlimited. It is not a right to keep and carry any weapon whatsoever in any manner whatsoever and for whatever purpose". They also clarified that many longstanding prohibitions and restrictions on firearms possession listed by the Court are consistent with the Second Amendment.[11]'

I do not, in any way, support gun rights. Guns are tools of killing, nothing more.

Also, giving a gun to a five year old is utterly outrageous. There is no way to defend it whatsoever. Kids of that age have no concept of life and death, so why on Earth should they be allowed to wave around a killing machine? And don't blather on about how it's 'the parent's fault', attempting to defend the second amendment as though it were your own daughter, since it is entirely the fault of the constitution for allowing the parents to purchase a rifle and hand it over to their barely-educated child, who may not even be able to hold it correctly.